SEPTEMBER 26, 2000

1 UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK

2 ------------------------------x

3 CARYL B. LEVENTHAL,

4 Plaintiff,

5 v. 99 Civ. 10405 SAS

6 JANET RENO, Hon., Attorney

General of the United States,

7

Defendant.

8

------------------------------x

9

New York, N.Y.

11

Before:

12

HON. SHIRA A. SCHEINDLIN,

13

District Judge

14

APPEARANCES

15 MICHAEL R. BRESSLER

Attorney for Plaintiff

16 LILA AYERS

SHERILYN DANDRIDGE

17

MARY JO WHITE

18 United States Attorney for the

Southern District of New York

19 ERIC FISHER

SHEILA GOWAN

20 Assistant United States Attorneys

21 TRIAL

22

23

24

25

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

269

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 (Jury present)

2 BRENDA GRANT,

3 called as a witness by the defendant,

4 having been duly sworn, testified as follows:

5 DIRECT EXAMINATION

6 BY MR. FISHER:

7 Q. Mrs. Grant, are you currently employed?

8 A. Yes, sir.

9 Q. Where?

10 A. The U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service located

11 970 Broad Street, Newark, New Jersey.

12 Q. What is your current title?

13 A. I'm a supervisory district adjudication officer.

14 Q. What are your responsibilities as supervisory district

15 adjudication officers?

16 A. I assign work to officers as well as clerks at the Newark

17 district office at the present time. We handle Congressional

18 cases, advance parole people who are trying to obtain travel

19 documents, employment authorization cards and many other

20 things.

21 Q. How many employees do you currently supervise?

22 A. I have eleven officers and eight clerks.

23 Q. How long have you been in the New Jersey office?

24 A. Since November 8, 1999.

25 Q. Where were you stationed before that?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

270

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 A. 26 Federal Plaza.

2 Q. In Manhattan?

3 A. Yes, sir.

4 Q. When did you start working for the INS?

5 A. September 13, 1971.

6 Q. How many years had you spent in the New York office before

7 you moved to the New Jersey office?

8 A. 28 years and a couple of months.

9 Q. Are you familiar with Section 245 in the Manhattan office

10 of the INS?

11 A. Yes, I am.

12 Q. How are you familiar with Section 245?

13 A. I was a supervisory applications clerk back in 1982.

14 Q. And you held that position in Section 245?

15 A. Yes, I did.

16 Q. Let me focus your attention on the period from October

17 1995 through January 1996. What was your position then?

18 A. I was a supervisory district adjudication officer for

19 Section 245.

20 Q. And who did you supervise during that period?

21 A. Caryl Leventhal.

22 Q. Anyone else?

23 A. Yes, at that time Agatha Stewart and a few others.

24 Q. And who did you report to?

25 A. I reported to Gwynne MacPherson who was my first line

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

271

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 supervisor.

2 Q. And what was Ms. MacPherson's position at that time?

3 A. She was the section chief of the unit.

4 Q. When did you first meet Caryl Leventhal?

5 A. Back in October of 1995 when she reported for duty.

6 Q. Are you familiar with the responsibilities of a

7 supervisory applications clerk?

8 A. Yes, I am.

9 Q. What were Mrs. Leventhal's responsibilities as supervisory

10 applications clerk when she began in 1995?

11 A. She had to assign work to application clerks which had to

12 process the applications for those applicants that were

13 applying for green cards. She also to assign work to the

14 typists so they could prepare the forms, in order to have the

15 officers prepared prior to the interviews.

16 Q. Did she have additional responsibilities?

17 A. Yes, she had to review the sign-in sheets, the time and

18 attendance reports and make sure that they were correct so the

19 employees could be paid properly.

20 Q. During the period from October 1995 through January 1996

21 when you were Mrs. Leventhal's first line supervisor, did you

22 have occasion to review her work?

23 A. Yes, I did.

24 Q. How did Mrs. Leventhal perform her work duties?

25 A. She was incompetent, she could not perform the functions

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

272

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 of the actual job itself. She made many errors.

2 Q. What makes you say that?

3 A. We reviewed the applications that she had to process. She

4 failed to assign the work to the application clerks and the

5 typists as well.

6 Q. Again during this period when you were the first line

7 supervisor, are there any other work problems that you noted?

8 A. She failed to complete the time and attendance reports,

9 she assigned herself leave instead of giving it to the

10 applicant in order to give it to the first line supervisor.

11 Q. When you say she wasn't assigning work to the clerks, what

12 impact does that have on Section 245?

13 A. We have goals to reach that's given to us by headquarters

14 in Washington, D.C. We're mandated in order to complete the

15 goals, in order to complete the processing of the

16 applications.

17 Q. What happens to those goals when the work is not assigned?

18 A. We have Congressional problems where people are calling

19 their congressman in order to find out what's going on with

20 the actual application.

21 Q. You mentioned problems with the time and attendance

22 sheets. What happens when those are not completed correctly?

23 A. People are not paid timely. If you do not monitor the

24 leave, you could issue leave to someone who may not have a

25 balance in order to complete the job.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

273

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 Q. When did you first begin to notice these performance

2 problems?

3 A. About the first or second month after her being on duty.

4 Q. What did you do about that?

5 A. I spoke to her on several occasions about the actual

6 errors.

7 Q. How often did you speak to Mrs. Leventhal about her

8 performance problems?

9 A. Almost on a daily basis.

10 Q. Did you show her how to do the work correctly?

11 A. Yes, I did. Many times.

12 Q. And how did she respond to your instructions?

13 A. I sent her back at least three or four times on one

14 specific item and she still could not complete the assignment.

15 Q. I'm not asking you about a specific item but generally,

16 how would she respond to your regular instructions correcting

17 her work performance?

18 MR. BRESSLER: Objection. I believe this is hearsay.

19 THE COURT: You're not calling for the words, just

20 the performance.

21 MR. FISHER: I'm asking how Mrs. Leventhal would

22 respond.

23 THE COURT: You mean performance-wise or what she

24 said?

25 MR. FISHER: Performance-wise.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

274

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 THE COURT: I'll allow it.

2 Q. Did her performance change in response to your

3 instructions?

4 A. No, it did not.

5 Q. And who was your supervisor at this time?

6 A. Ms. MacPherson.

7 Q. Did you discuss Mrs. Leventhal's job performance with

8 Mrs. MacPherson?

9 A. Many times.

10 Q. Why did you do that?

11 A. I must report everything to my first line supervisor when

12 things are not proper.

13 Q. Now, in January 1996, was there a change in your

14 responsibilities within Section 245?

15 A. Yes.

16 Q. What was the change?

17 A. Mrs. MacPherson was promoted to the deputy district

18 director for examinations and I, in fact, got her job as an

19 acting section chief.

20 Q. When you were acting section chief, did you continue to

21 supervise Mrs. Leventhal's work?

22 A. Yes, on a second line level.

23 Q. What does that mean?

24 A. That means that she would have a first line supervisor, at

25 that time it was Agatha Stewart, and I was the second line

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

275

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 supervisor over her.

2 Q. During this period when you were Mrs. Leventhal's second

3 line supervisor, did you continue to be aware of her work

4 performance?

5 A. Yes.

6 Q. How is it that you learned of her job performance during

7 that period when you were her second line supervisor?

8 A. We were on the same floor together and I noticed that a

9 lot of clerical employees did not have work assignments.

10 Q. And was the fact that the clerical employees did not have

11 work assignments somehow related to Mrs. Leventhal's

12 responsibilities?

13 A. Yes.

14 Q. How?

15 A. They didn't have work to complete, and that means we

16 couldn't reach the goals and therefore we didn't have cases

17 ready for the officers to interview prior to the interviews.

18 Q. Was it your practice to keep a record concerning

19 Mrs. Leventhal's job performance?

20 A. Yes, sir.

21 Q. Why did you keep such a record?

22 A. All supervisors when you're hired, you're on a

23 probationary period. If you cannot accomplish the job itself,

24 then we are to monitor you and dismiss you if you're

25 incompetent, if you can't, you know, complete the functions of

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

276

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 your duties.

2 Q. I'm not sure that that answered my question. Why is it

3 that you kept a record of her job performance?

4 A. Because she was incompetent.

5 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, may I approach the witness?

6 THE COURT: Yes.

7 (Handed to the witness)

8 Q. Mrs. Grant, I'm showing you what's been marked as

9 Defendant's Exhibit I for identification purposes. Do you

10 recognize this document?

11 A. Yes, I do.

12 Q. Please review the pages and tell us what it is.

13 A. There are a lot of my notes. Also notes from

14 Mrs. Leventhal. Also notes from Agatha Stewart which was the

15 fires line supervisor. And copies of the T & As, time and

16 attendance sheets.

17 Q. Are these all notes that you collected?

18 A. Yes.

19 Q. Did you collect them in the ordinary course of your

20 business with the INS?

21 A. Yes.

22 Q. And were they kept in the ordinary course of the INS's

23 business?

24 A. Yes.

25 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, I offer Defendant's Exhibit

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

277

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 I into evidence.

2 MR. BRESSLER: Your Honor, I object. I believe this

3 is not a business -- I mean, there's no evidence that this is

4 normally kept in the normal course of business.

5 THE COURT: Let's find that out. You kind of went

6 through that pretty quickly. I have under I about a hundred

7 pages here. Are you talking about the whole record?

8 MR. FISHER: Yes, your Honor.

9 Q. Mrs. Grant, why did you collect all of these documents?

10 THE COURT: It's not a matter of collect, it's a

11 matter of prepare. If you are going to offer this as a

12 business record, I'd have to go through each one and see

13 whether it was prepared in the ordinary course of business and

14 whether it was the ordinary course of business to prepare such

15 records. That is what is required under the business records

16 exception.

17 MR. FISHER: Let me ask Mrs. Grant about certain

18 specific questions.

19 THE COURT: Maybe that would be best.

20 Q. Mrs. Grant, please turn to page, what's been marked as

21 page 174. You'll find the numbers in the lower right-hand

22 corner.

23 THE COURT: Do you see them?

24 THE WITNESS: Yes.

25 THE COURT: Let's go to 174. These are handwritten

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

278

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 notes dated January 18, 1996.

2 THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am.

3 THE COURT: These are your notes?

4 THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am.

5 THE COURT: Without telling us what the notes say,

6 are they about events that occurred at work?

7 THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am.

8 THE COURT: And was it your practice to make such

9 handwritten notes regarding events that occurred at work?

10 THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am.

11 THE COURT: Why did you do that, not that particular

12 one, why do you regularly take such handwritten notes?

13 THE WITNESS: Bus after three months being on the

14 job, Ms. Leventhal was incompetent so therefore I had to start

15 keeping notes.

16 THE COURT: I'm not saying this particular note but

17 why in general would you keep handwritten notes on

18 probationary employees?

19 THE WITNESS: Because that's a requirement for my

20 job.

21 THE COURT: You've done this for many probationary

22 employees?

23 THE WITNESS: Oh, yes, most definitely.

24 THE COURT: Kept handwritten notes on a regular

25 basis.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

279

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am.

2 THE COURT: All right. And then is it your practice

3 to keep such notes with respect to particular probationary

4 employees?

5 THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am.

6 THE COURT: All right. Then I think this particular

7 set of notes does meet the business records exception. It

8 seems to me it's made and kept in the ordinary course of

9 business.

10 MR. BRESSLER: May I voir dire?

11 THE COURT: Yes, all right.

12 VOIR DIRE EXAMINATION

13 BY MR. BRESSLER:

14 Q. Ms. Grant, you testified you took these notes because

15 Ms. Leventhal was an incompetent employee, isn't that correct?

16 A. That's correct.

17 Q. So you only take notes on employees that are incompetent,

18 is that correct?

19 A. That's correct.

20 Q. So in the ordinary course of business, you don't take

21 notes on any employee, only what you deem incompetent

22 employees?

23 A. That's correct.

Note: And I suppose that the large percentage of people under you who were subsequently arrested and terminated for criminal behavior at INS were competent employees?  These are the ones you claimed were good workers during your deposition.  Certainly, they were competent enough to make hundreds of thousands of dollars (confirmed by newspaper articles that the judge refused to allow us to produce) shaking down immigrants and lawyers... and doing it right under your nose.  If Caryl Leventhal could see it why couldn't a "competent" manager like you?  One wonders if you wanted to.  Caryl caught on to this within the first two weeks of her employment, but you took no action.

24 MR. BRESSLER: Your Honor, then I ask that this not

25 be admitted, this is hearsay.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

280

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 THE COURT: We're going in a circle but I've got to

2 complete the circle. With other probationary employees, not

3 just Ms. Leventhal, whenever you have a problem with a

4 probationary employee, is it your practice to make handwritten

5 notes to document the problem.

6 THE WITNESS: Yes.

7 THE COURT: Not just this employee.

8 THE WITNESS: Not just this employee.

9 THE COURT: Any probationary employee with whom you

10 have a problem?

11 THE WITNESS: Yes.

12 THE COURT: Was that more than one probationary

13 employee in the time you were a supervisor?

14 THE WITNESS: Yes.

15 THE COURT: Was it more than five would you say?

16 THE WITNESS: I wouldn't say five.

17 THE COURT: On how many would you say that you took

18 these types of notes?

19 THE WITNESS: At least two.

20 MR. BRESSLER: May I proceed.

21 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, I'm not sure --

22 THE COURT: He's doing a voir dire on the document

23 that you seem to feel the need to offer. Go ahead.

24 BY MR. BRESSLER:

25 Q. How many employees have you supervised in your career at

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

281

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 INS?

2 A. Well, as a supervisory applications clerk, I had 35

3 clerks. As a supervisory district adjudication officer, I

4 supervise over 40 officers. So it depends.

5 Q. And this is over about a 30 year period, isn't that right?

6 A. Yes.

7 Q. So of all those employees, you twice took notes such as

8 this in your career.

9 A. That's correct. Because when an employee is doing well, I

10 write them up for awards.

11 MR. BRESSLER: Your Honor, I can't see how this is in

12 the normal course of business.

13 THE COURT: The other question I would have for you,

14 Ms. Grant, is without having this in front of you and being

15 able to read it, could you recite what it says word for word?

16 THE WITNESS: Somewhat, yes.

17 THE COURT: From first word to last, could you recite

18 this without looking at it?

19 THE WITNESS: It's been since 1996, your Honor.

20 THE COURT: So you couldn't, right.

21 THE WITNESS: No.

22 THE COURT: This is what you wrote at the time, is

23 that correct?

24 THE WITNESS: Yes.

25 THE COURT: I am going to admit this record on the

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

282

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 basis of it being a business record and past recollection

2 recorded. What's the next one you want?

3 MR. FISHER: Page 177.

4 THE COURT: Is this the same type of thing, is this

5 another note taken on January 19, 1996.

6 THE WITNESS: Yes.

7 THE COURT: Same ruling. What's next?

8 MR. FISHER: Page 190.

9 THE COURT: Page 190. What is 190?

10 BY MR. FISHER:

11 Q. Mrs. Grant, are you familiar with the circumstances of the

12 preparation of the note that's reflected on page 190?

13 A. Yes, sir.

14 Q. What are the circumstances?

15 A. This is a memorandum of record. When someone calls the

16 office, okay, you may take a message at any time. And this is

17 a message to Ms. MacPherson, Maria was a clerk that was on the

18 8th floor, and Ms. Leventhal took the message and she wrote

19 our extension which is on the 10th floor.

20 Q. Did you collect this document?

21 A. Yes, I did.

22 Q. Why is it that you collected it?

23 A. This is to show her incompetence.

24 THE COURT: So there are two messages on this page,

25 is that right?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

283

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 THE WITNESS: Sure. There's a second page that's

2 addressed to me which is from Phil who was an officer from the

3 officer inspector general. And he called me and instead of

4 her taking Phil's number, she wrote down our extension, which

5 is 3970.

6 Q. Did Mrs. Leventhal prepare these phone messages in the

7 ordinary course of her responsibilities as a supervisory

8 applications clerk?

9 A. Yes, sir.

10 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, I offer page 190.

11 MR. BRESSLER: Your Honor, I object.

12 THE COURT: 190 is received both as a business record

13 as a statement of a party opponent. What else?

14 MR. FISHER: Page 212.

15 THE COURT: Page 212.

16 Q. Mrs. Grant, is this a note that you wrote?

17 A. Just one second, I don't have the page yet.

18 Q. I apologize.

19 A. Yes, it is.

20 Q. And did you write this note in the ordinary course of your

21 responsibilities as Mrs. Leventhal's second line supervisor?

22 A. Yes, sir.

23 THE COURT: This is not a business record,

24 Mr. Fisher. I can't allow this one. Go ahead.

25 Q. Mrs. Grant, did you have responsibilities for supervising

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

284

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 Mrs. Leventhal during the course of her employment?

2 A. Yes, I did.

3 Q. And in that capacity, when Mrs. Leventhal made mistakes,

4 were you required to bring those mistakes to her attention?

5 A. Yes, I was.

6 Q. And when you brought those mistakes to her attention, did

7 you do that in the ordinary course of your responsibilities as

8 her second line supervisor?

9 A. Yes, I did.

10 Q. And these records, when you brought mistakes to

11 Mrs. Leventhal's attention, were they kept in the ordinary

12 course of the INS business?

13 THE COURT: I told you I could not admit this as a

14 business record. It doesn't matter how many more questions

15 you ask, this is not a business record.

16 Q. Please turn to pages 243 and 244.

17 THE COURT: Are they part of the same document? This

18 is just the second page of the same document?

19 MR. FISHER: Yes, your Honor.

20 THE COURT: I'm not going to admit this as a business

21 record.

22 MR. FISHER: May I try to lay a foundation for it?

23 THE COURT: No. It's not a business record. Mind

24 you, I have no problem with your questioning the witness about

25 much of this. It's just the document that's a problem. I'm

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

285

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 sure you can go over all of this in testimony.

2 Q. Mrs. Grant, did Mrs. Leventhal have problems with a form

3 G-100?

4 A. Yes.

5 Q. What is a form G-100?

6 A. That's a small form that's used to request a file from

7 another operating section within Immigration.

8 Q. And what kind of problem did she have with it?

9 A. She could not properly complete the form. It was a very

10 small form where you would complete the requester, which would

11 be the unit that's requesting the actual file, you would have

12 the applicant's name and the alien registration number on the

13 form.

14 Q. And did Mrs. Leventhal have problems notating employee

15 sign-in sheets?

16 A. Yes, she did.

17 MR. BRESSLER: Objection.

18 THE COURT: I'll allow that.

19 MR. BRESSLER: It's lead -- all right.

20 Q. What sort of problems did she have with that?

21 A. After being on the job for a few months, she could not

22 properly complete and sign off on the actual sign-in sheets

23 and the T & A, time and attendance reports. There was times

24 when she would grant leave to an employee where she did not

25 check the actual leave balances to see what each employee

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

286

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 would have. And she would authorize the leave.

2 Q. How was Mrs. Leventhal's judgment when it came to

3 authorizing annual leave for employees?

4 MR. BRESSLER: Objection to form.

5 THE COURT: Repeat the question.

6 Q. How was Mrs. Leventhal's judgment when it came to

7 authorizing annual leave for employees?

8 THE COURT: It's a little strangely worded. Are you

9 asking her if as a supervisor she agreed with Ms. Leventhal's

10 decisions with respect to annual leave for other employees?

11 Q. Did Mrs. Leventhal show reasonable judgment when it came

12 to authorizing annual leave for other employees?

13 THE COURT: In your view as a supervisor.

14 A. Not good at all.

15 Q. Did Mrs. Leventhal ever complain to you about having to

16 carry heavy boxes?

17 A. Yes, she did.

18 Q. What did she tell you?

19 A. She told me that the boxes were a little bit too heavy for

20 her to lift, for her to move around.

21 Q. When she told you that, what did you tell her?

22 A. I told her that she had wagons, two wagons in the office,

23 and she also had a clerical staff, she was the supervisor.

24 Q. And what was the significance of that, that she had a

25 clerical staff?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

287

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 A. That means that she could assign the work to have someone

2 else lift the boxes for her.

3 Q. Did she do that?

4 A. I guess so. I don't really know. She complained to me

5 and I told her what to do. So if there was anything further

6 than that, I don't know.

7 Q. Did Ms. Leventhal ever complain to you about having to

8 reach up to high shelves?

9 A. Yes, she did.

10 Q. What did she tell you about that?

11 A. She told me she had difficulty reaching up top to retrieve

12 the files.

13 Q. What was your response?

14 A. I told her that she had a clerical staff, that she could

15 assign the work to to retrieve whatever she needed.

16 Q. Did Mrs. Leventhal ever complain to you about anything

17 else relating to her job?

18 A. No, she did not.

19 Q. Mrs. Grant, we've already referred to annual leave but I

20 don't think you've explained what annual leave is. What is

21 it?

22 A. Annual leave is vacation time, vacation leave.

23 Q. And does the INS have a policy for authorizing vacation

24 time?

25 A. Yes.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

288

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 Q. What is the policy?

2 A. There is a form called an SF-71 that you must submit to

3 your supervisor to request leave in advance. Otherwise you

4 must call in for emergency annual leave and speak to your

5 first line supervisor.

6 Q. As a supervisor at the INS, did you have to from time to

7 time approve SF-71 requests for vacation from employees who

8 you supervised?

9 A. Many times.

10 Q. What are the factors that a supervisor considers when he

11 or she has to decide whether or not to grant annual leave?

12 A. Always service needs first of all. Secondly, seniority.

13 Q. When you say service needs, what do you mean?

14 A. That means you must be able to run your unit. You must be

15 able to have employees there in order to complete the job

16 assignment.

17 Q. And typically, when is it that the annual leave schedule

18 is worked out? I'm speaking now about the practice at Section

19 245 in the New York office of the INS.

20 A. Every February of each year, employees will submit their

21 forms requesting the leave for that particular leave year.

22 Q. Were there ever any disagreements between you and

23 Mrs. Leventhal when it came to authorizing her annual leave?

24 A. Yes.

25 Q. What happened?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

289

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 A. Ms. Leventhal submitted a memorandum of her staff letting

2 me know which employees requested leave. On that particular

3 memorandum, it had her name on it, so therefore she was

4 granting herself leave. She never submitted the proper form

5 to the first line supervisor.

6 Q. When you say she did not submit the proper form, does that

7 mean that with respect to the incident you're recalling, she

8 never submitted a form SF-71?

9 A. That's correct.

10 Q. And you did not approve the leave?

11 A. That's correct.

12 Q. In addition to her not submitting a form SF-71, are there

13 any other reasons why you denied her the leave that day?

14 A. No.

15 Q. How did Mrs. Leventhal respond to your decision not to

16 authorize her leave?

17 MR. BRESSLER: Objection.

18 THE COURT: Did she say anything?

19 A. If I recall correctly, I think she was a little upset

20 about it.

21 THE COURT: All right. Do you remember anything she

22 said or just that she appeared upset?

23 THE WITNESS: She just appeared upset.

24 THE COURT: Okay.

25 Q. Did Mrs. Leventhal tell you that she wanted the leave for

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

290

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 religious reasons?

2 A. I don't recall that.

3 Q. In general, how was Mrs. Leventhal's attendance record?

4 A. Very poor.

5 Q. What makes you say that?

6 A. Since being employed by Immigration, she was really out a

7 lot, she was out a lot according to the records.

8 MR. BRESSLER: I'll object. It's not responsive.

9 THE COURT: It was totally responsive. The

10 attendance record, that was the question.

11 MR. BRESSLER: In the whole, entire --

12 THE COURT: That's what she said.

13 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, may I approach the witness?

14 THE COURT: Yes.

15 Q. Mrs. Grant, I'm showing you what's been marked as

16 Defendant's Exhibit C for identification purposes.

17 (Handed to the witness)

18 Q. Do you recognize this document?

19 A. Yes, I do.

20 Q. What is it?

21 A. It's a memorandum that we issue to employees that we feel

22 are leave abusers, their leave is very low, so we just want to

23 give them like a reminder to let them know that their balance

24 is low.

25 Q. Do you typically prepare such a document in the ordinary

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

291

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 course of the INS's business?

2 A. Yes.

3 Q. And is this sort of document ordinarily kept in the

4 ordinary course of the INS's business?

5 A. Yes.

6 Q. And does this document relate to a particular employee?

7 A. Yes, it does.

8 Q. Who?

9 A. Caryl Leventhal.

10 MR. FISHER: I offer Defendant's Exhibit C into

11 evidence.

12 THE COURT: Is this offered as a business record?

13 MR. FISHER: Yes, your Honor.

14 MR. BRESSLER: Your Honor, may I?

15 VOIR DIRE EXAMINATION

16 BY MR. BRESSLER:

17 Q. What's the date of this letter or memo?

18 A. June 10, 1996.

19 Q. Was Ms. Leventhal working on that day?

20 A. No, she wasn't.

21 Q. Did you give this document to Ms. Leventhal?

22 A. No, I did not.

23 Q. Was this addressed to Ms. Leventhal?

24 A. Yes, it is.

25 Q. To your knowledge, did Ms. Leventhal ever receive this

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

292

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 letter?

2 A. I don't recall.

3 MR. BRESSLER: Your Honor, I object.

4 THE COURT: On what basis, that it's not a business

5 record?

6 MR. BRESSLER: Okay, I'll --

7 THE COURT: Overruled. It's a business record.

8 (Defendant's Exhibit C received in evidence)

9 Q. Mrs. Grant, did there come a time when you decided that

10 Mrs. Leventhal should be terminated?

11 A. Yes, I did.

12 Q. When did you decide that?

13 A. After being on the job for three months and her not being

14 able to complete the duties of her job.

15 Q. Well, this view that you came to after three months, did

16 you discuss it with anyone?

17 A. Yes, I did.

18 Q. Who?

19 A. My immediate supervisor, Gwynne MacPherson, Agatha

20 Stewart, my co-worker, and Mr. Richard Berryman, who is the

21 assistant district director.

22 Q. Did there come a time when you sent a memo recommending

23 the termination?

24 A. Yes, I did.

25 Q. When did you send that memo?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

293

09qilev5 ag

Grant - direct

1 A. I think it was in February of 1996.

2 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, may I approach the witness?

3 THE COURT: No. It's too close to 4:30, so I'm going

4 to thank the jury and remind you not to discuss the case with

5 each other or with anyone else. We will convene tomorrow I

6 hope more promptly than today, my fault, ten o'clock.

7 Let me give you some idea of the schedule. Without

8 being certain, I expect the evidence will close tomorrow. I

9 expect we'll have summations tomorrow. We may well even have

10 the charge tomorrow, I can't promise all those three things

11 but that's my best expectation. You may even get the case for

12 deliberation tomorrow but at the latest Thursday. So we're on

13 schedule. I just wanted to tell you that.

14 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, one request and that is that

15 the jury specifically be instructed not to look at the website

16 that was mentioned.

17 THE COURT: Yes. For those of you who are web

18 surfers, please don't sign onto that website. That would be a

19 mistake and would violate my earlier instructions in the case

20 not to do any independent research. So resist. Thank you,

21 very much.

SEPTEMBER 27, 2000

9 THE COURT: Ms. Grant, you can come up to the witness

10 stand.

11 Mr. Bressler?

12 MR. BRESSLER: No, your Honor.

13 THE COURT: No changes. OK.

14 We are ready for the jury.

15 (Continued on next page)

16

17

18

19

20

21

22

23

24

25

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

314

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 (Jury present)

2 BRENDA GRANT,

3 Resumed, and testified further as follows:

4 THE COURT: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.

5 We are ready to begin. This is Ms. Grant resuming on

6 direct.

7 DIRECT EXAMINATION (Continued)

8 BY MR. BRESSLER:

9 Q. Mrs. Grant, was Caryl Leventhal responsible in her

10 capacity as supervisory applications clerk for taking

11 telephone messages?

12 A. Yes, she was.

13 MR. BRESSLER: Objection. Leading.

14 THE COURT: Overruled.

15 Q. And in connection with that responsibility, how did she

16 perform?

17 A. Not too well. She couldn't take a decent message.

18 Q. And why do you say that?

19 A. She would take the person's name where she failed to note

20 the person's phone number, the return number.

21 Q. How often did this happen?

22 A. A lot.

23 Q. In her capacity as supervisory applications clerk, was she

24 also responsible for granting annual leave to the clerks who

25 she supervised?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

315

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 A. Yes, sir.

2 Q. And in connection with that responsibility, how did she

3 perform?

4 A. Not too well. She failed to check their leave balances

5 prior to granting the leave.

6 Q. And what is the problem with that?

7 A. That means the person could be placed on absent without

8 leave or requests leave without pay.

9 MR. BRESSLER: Your Honor --

10 Q. Was she also responsible for locating files?

11 A. Yes, sir, as part of her job.

12 Q. What sort of files?

13 A. The applicants that apply for permanent residency, we have

14 to have a file for them in order to process the application.

15 Q. And how was her performance in that regard?

16 A. Not too good.

17 Q. And why do you say that?

18 A. We had a lot of loose applications where we needed to

19 obtain the files from various offices, sections.

20 Q. I'm sorry, I cut you off. Did you finish your answer?

21 A. And sections.

22 Q. And what happens when there are loose applications?

23 A. That means that we can't properly send the FBI checks out

24 to the appropriate centers to check on people's criminal

25 backgrounds and things of that nature.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

316

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 Q. Was she responsible for assigning work to her

2 subordinates?

3 A. Yes, sir.

4 Q. And how did she perform those responsibilities?

5 A. Not well at all.

6 Q. And why do you say that, Mrs. Grant?

7 A. There were a lot of times that the application clerks and

8 typists did not have work assignments. I myself had to assign

9 the work to them.

10 Q. Mrs. Grant, did there come a time when you sent a

11 memorandum up the chain of command recommending

12 Mrs. Grant's -- excuse me, Mrs. Leventhal's termination?

13 A. Yes, sir.

14 Q. When was that?

15 A. The first one I believe was in February of 1996.

16 Q. And what happened with that memorandum?

17 A. It didn't go forward.

18 Q. Why not?

19 A. I chose to just wait and see what would -- you know, maybe

20 she would show some sort of improvement.

21 Q. Did she show improvement?

22 A. No, she did not.

23 Q. Did there come a time when you sent another memorandum up

24 the chain of command recommending her termination?

25 A. Yes, sir.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

317

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 Q. When was that?

2 A. In June of 1996.

3 Q. Why did you send another memorandum then?

4 A. She showed no improvement and, in fact, I had more

5 problems with her during that time.

6 Q. This memorandum that you sent in June of 1996, who did you

7 send it to?

8 A. I sent it to Mary Ann Gantner, who is the deputy district

9 director for the New York district office.

10 Q. Did you send it directly to her?

11 A. It goes through a chain of command.

12 Q. And what is the chain of command that it goes through?

13 A. My immediate supervisor, who was Gwynne MacPherson, on to

14 Mr. Berryman and then to Ms. Gantner.

15 Q. Who is Mr. Berryman?

16 A. Mr. Berryman is the assistant district director for

17 examinations in the New York district office.

18 Q. And, Ms. Gantner, who you just told us about, who does he

19 report to?

20 A. Edward J. McElroy.

21 Q. What is Mr. McElroy's position?

22 A. He was the district director for the New York district

23 office.

24 Q. And who is it that made the final decision with respect to

25 Mrs. Leventhal's termination?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

318

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 A. Mr. McElroy.

2 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, may I approach the witness?

3 THE COURT: Yes.

4 (Handing)

5 Q. Mrs. Grant, I have just handed you what's been marked as

6 Defendants' Exhibit N, for identification purposes.

7 Please look at the document and tell me whether you

8 recognize it?

9 A. Yes, I do.

10 Q. What is this?

11 A. It's my memorandum to Ms. Gantner recommending termination

12 for Ms. Leventhal.

13 Q. And when is it dated?

14 A. It's dated July 24, 1996.

15 Q. And was this the final memorandum where you recommended

16 Mrs. Leventhal's termination?

17 A. Yes, sir.

18 Q. Did you prepare this termination in the ordinary course of

19 your responsibilities as a supervisor at INS?

20 A. Yes, sir.

21 Q. And was this record maintained by the INS in the ordinary

22 course of its business?

23 A. Yes, sir.

24 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, I offer Defendants' Exhibit

25 N into evidence.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

319

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 THE COURT: What is the number again?

2 MR. FISHER: N, as in Nancy.

3 THE COURT: N as in Nancy. N is received.

4 Any objection, Mr. Bressler?

5 MR. BRESSLER: No, your Honor.

6 THE COURT: N is received.

7 (Defendant's Exhibit N received in evidence)

8 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, may I approach?

9 (Handing)

10 Q. Mrs. Grant, I have just handed you what is in evidence as

11 Plaintiff's Exhibit 16.

12 I would like you first to focus on the second page of

13 this exhibit. Do you recognize the second page?

14 A. Yes, I do.

15 Q. What is that?

16 A. It's a memorandum to me from Mrs. Leventhal in reference

17 to her employees' leave request.

18 Q. Who prepared the memo?

19 A. Mrs. Leventhal.

20 Q. And did you receive it?

21 A. Yes, I did.

22 Q. What did you do when you received it?

23 A. I wrote a note back to her telling her how could she grant

24 her own self leave, first of all, and why she took off at the

25 same time as her lead clerk.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

320

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 Q. Let me refer you to the first page of this exhibit; is

2 that a copy of the note that you just mentioned?

3 A. Yes, sir.

4 Q. Would you please read the note.

5 A. "Was every clerical employee asked to submit their leave

6 request? I believe you are missing many of your employees.

7 Had you approved their leave? Is it a good idea to take off

8 the same day as your lead clerk?"

9 Q. What did you mean when you wrote "Is it a good idea to

10 take off the same day as your lead clerk?"

11 A. That meant who would run the section.

12 Q. Did Mrs. Leventhal tell you that she was seeking this day

13 off for religious reasons?

14 A. No, she did not.

15 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, I would like to publish

16 Plaintiff's Exhibit 16 to the jury.

17 THE COURT: That is fine.

18 MR. FISHER: May I hand it to the jurors and ask them

19 to pass it down?

20 THE COURT: Yes.

21 That is in evidence, right?

22 MR. FISHER: Yes, it is it is, your Honor.

23 MR. BRESSLER: Yes, your Honor.

24 THE COURT: Sure. Of course.

25 (Handing to the jury)

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

321

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 BY MR. FISHER:

2 Q. Mrs. Grant, you've testified about this exhibit and that

3 you wrote to Mrs. Leventhal "Is it a good idea to take off the

4 same day as your lead clerk." Who was Mrs. Leventhal's lead

5 clerk?

6 A. Dolores Filbert.

7 Q. Mrs. Grant, does the INS have a policy for employees who

8 wish to take off from work because they are sick?

9 A. Yes.

10 Q. Are you familiar with the policy?

11 A. Yes, I am.

12 Q. What is the policy?

13 A. If you're sick you're to call in to your immediate

14 supervisor and get the authorization granted. If you know in

15 advance, then you are to put in your leave request form. If

16 you are out three consecutive days, then you are to bring in a

17 medical doctor's note.

Note: Well, maybe in our system of justice, juries are considered too stupid to see a note written in plain English by a family physician, but thanks to the internet, it is available for the world to see with a simple click on this hyperlink.

18 Q. Are you familiar with the term "AWOL"?

19 A. Yes, I am.

20 Q. What does it stand for?

21 A. Absence without official leave.

22 Q. And what does that mean?

23 A. That means your leave has not been authorized by your

24 supervisor or you failed to call in.

25 Q. Now, did there come a time in June 1996 when

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

322

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 Mrs. Leventhal was marked AWOL?

2 A. Yes, sir.

3 Q. Who marked her AWOL?

4 A. I did, and Agatha Stewart.

5 Q. And at the time that she was marked AWOL, did

6 Mrs. Leventhal have accrued sick days?

7 A. She had some hours, yes.

8 Q. Well, if she had some hours accrued, why is it that she

9 was marked AWOL?

10 A. She failed to call in and speak to her supervisor to get

11 the leave authorized.

12 Q. Well, did anyone call in on her behalf?

13 A. Yes.

14 Q. Who did?

15 A. Her husband.

16 Q. And when her husband called in on her behalf, did you

17 speak with him?

18 A. Yes, I did.

19 Q. What was his demeanor?

20 A. Very rude, very nasty.

21 Q. Did you yell at him?

22 A. No, I didn't yell at him, he yelled at me.

23 Q. And what did you do?

24 A. I hung up.

25 Q. Did you ever learn that Mrs. Leventhal has multiple

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

323

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 sclerosis?

2 A. I found out after the fact while she was on AWOL.

3 Q. And do you remember when it was that you started marking

4 her AWOL?

5 A. I'm sorry, I didn't get the question.

6 Q. I'm sorry. Do you remember when it was that you started

7 marking her AWOL?

8 A. It was sometime in June of '96.

9 Q. Did you ever see a doctor's note referring to

10 Mrs. Leventhal having multiple sclerosis?

Note: Well, maybe in our system of justice, juries are considered too stupid to see a note written in plain English by a family physician, but thanks to the internet, it is available for the world to see with a simple click on this hyperlink.

11 A. Yes, I did.

12 Q. When?

13 A. Sometime after June of '96.

14 Q. Did Mrs. Leventhal's AWOL days, the days that she was

15 marked AWOL, did they play a role in your decision to

16 recommend her termination?

17 A. No, sir.

Note: Oh Yea...?  then why, when you presented your request for Caryl Leventhal's termination on the grounds of her not showing up for work, didn't you ever mention that she was home seriously ill?  It was one of the many reasons you wanted her out.  Did these reasons also include her attempting to stop the rampant on-site, subsequently confirmed, criminal activity going on in your area?  But you didn't mention this either and judge Scheindlin ruled this evidence to be inadmissible.  Why is everyone attempting to cover for what went on in 1995-1996 in the way of corruption?  It was a primary reason why Ms. Leventhal's staff wanted her out.  She was making trouble relative to their being brazenly open in this activity.

18 Q. Not at all?

19 A. No.

20 Q. How would you describe your work relationship with

21 Mrs. Leventhal during the period that she was employed at the

22 INS?

23 A. We were decent to each other.

24 Q. Did you ever yell at her?

25 A. Yes, I did.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

324

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 Q. Why did you yell at her?

2 A. Because she failed to take messages properly, she failed

3 to assign the work to her staff, and many other issues.

4 Q. Well, did you yell at any of her employees?

5 A. Yes, I have.

6 Q. Why have you?

7 A. Because they failed to complete the duties of their job.

8 Q. At the time that Mrs. Leventhal was at the INS, did she

9 tell you anything about what religion she practiced?

10 A. No, she told me her husband was Jewish.

11 Q. Aside from that one discussion that you just mentioned,

12 did you have any other conversations with her about her

13 religion?

14 A. No, sir.

15 Q. Does the INS allow employees to put up holiday decorations

16 near their workstations?

17 A. Yes, we do.

18 Q. Did you ever tell Mrs. Leventhal that she could not put up

19 Hanukah decorations?

20 A. Never.

21 Q. Did you ever make the comment to Mrs. Leventhal about

22 eating matzah at work?

23 A. Never.

24 Q. Did you ever tell Mrs. Leventhal, If you leave now, I'll

25 give you a good reference?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

325

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 A. No.

2 Q. Did you ever have any conversations with anyone at the INS

3 about whether or not the INS Commissioner, Doris Meissner, was

4 Jewish?

5 A. No, sir.

6 Q. Did you ever gossip with anyone in Section 245 about

7 Mrs. Leventhal's Jewish practices?

8 A. No, sir.

9 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, I would like to publish to

10 the jury a copy of Defendants' Exhibit N, which has been

11 received into evidence. It is Mrs. Grant's termination

12 recommendation.

13 THE COURT: All right. You may give the jury the

14 exhibit.

15 (Handing to the jury)

16 BY MR. FISHER:

17 Q. Mrs. Grant --

18 JUROR NO. 3: You are missing one.

19 THE COURT: You are missing one copy.

20 MR. FISHER: I apologize. I have a copy.

21 Q. Mrs. Grant, let me turn your attention back to Defendants'

22 Exhibit N, as in Nancy, your termination recommendation, and I

23 draw your attention to the second page. It has the number 494

24 on the bottom.

25 A. Yes.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

326

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 Q. The bottom half of the page contains dates and it's got

2 numbers with decimals listed next to it. What does that refer

3 to?

4 A. That means the amount of leave that Ms. Leventhal took

5 during the course of her employment. The .2 means 15 minutes

6 and, you know.

7 Q. And can you help us with the acronyms? What does "EAL"

8 mean?

9 A. Emergency annual leave, which means she called in and it

10 was authorized.

11 Q. And what does "SL" mean?

12 A. Sick leave.

13 Q. And "AL"?

14 A. Annual leave.

15 Q. And just so that what you are telling us is complete, if

16 you look at the next page, the information carries over.

17 There are another two entries which contain dates and next to

18 it information about leave.

19 Now, let me first focus your attention on all of the

20 entries except the last one. So beginning 10-29-95 and going

21 through 5-29-96 -- do you see what I am referring to?

22 A. Yes.

23 Q. Why is it that you included that information in this

24 termination memo?

25 A. Just to let the Service know how much time she had taken

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

327

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - direct

1 during the course of her employment.

2 Q. Was there something notable about how much time she had

3 taken?

4 A. Yes, it's unusual for a probationary employee to take off

5 that much leave in the beginning of her course of time.

6 Q. Focus your attention on the last entry in this whole

7 series: 6-10-96 to date, 264 AWOL.

8 Now, you testified that the AWOL hours did not play a

9 role in your termination recommendation.

10 A. Right.

11 Q. Why is it then that you listed the AWOL hours as the last

12 entry in this series?

13 A. Because we're told to do that when we are completing an

14 actual memo. My personal reason for terminating

15 Mrs. Leventhal was because she was incompetent. OK? But I

16 had to list the amount of time that she had taken off, as

17 well, into my memorandum.

18 Q. Who tells you to do that?

19 A. My boss, Ms. MacPherson.

20 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, may I confer with co-counsel

21 for one moment?

22 THE COURT: Yes.

23 MR. FISHER: Thank you.

24 (Pause)

25 MR. FISHER: No further questions.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

328

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 THE COURT: Just before we begin the

2 cross-examination, the jury can remain in the box actually

3 viewing those two documents. I just need a short recess. I

4 will be right back.

5 Everybody can just stay put.

6 (Pause)

7 THE COURT: All right. Mr. Bressler.

8 CROSS-EXAMINATION

9 BY MR. BRESSLER:

10 Q. Ms. Grant, are you often aware -- well one question:

11 Ms. Grant, what is your current employment address?

12 A. 970 Broad Street, Newark, New Jersey.

13 Q. And how long have you been working in Newark?

14 A. Since November of 1999.

15 Q. OK. How long does it take you to commute to Newark?

16 MR. FISHER: Objection. Relevance.

17 MR. BRESSLER: Subject to connection, your Honor, if

18 I may ask two questions.

19 THE COURT: What is the length of your round trip?

20 THE WITNESS: An hour and a half.

21 BY MR. BRESSLER:

22 Q. And you didn't move to New Jersey when you got your job in

23 Newark?

24 A. No.

25 Q. So your job in Newark was a demotion, wasn't it?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

329

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 A. No, it was not.

2 Q. So you voluntarily chose to make this long commute to

3 Newark?

4 A. Yes, sir.

5 Q. Did your job title change when you moved to Newark?

6 A. No, it has not.

7 Q. So it was a lateral move but you voluntarily chose to take

8 this long commute to Newark, New Jersey?

9 A. That's correct.

10 Q. What was the reason for that?

11 A. Well, I have high blood pressure, number one. The job

12 that I was currently in was very stressful in Naturalization

13 so I decided to move to, you know, take a lateral to New

14 Jersey.

15 Q. And the commute didn't increase the stress in any way of

16 your job?

17 A. No.

18 Q. OK. Speaking of high blood pressure, did you ever mention

19 to Ms. Leventhal that you had high blood pressure?

20 A. I probably did. A lot of my employees know I have it.

21 Q. And at the time you told her that you have high blood

22 pressure, did Ms. Leventhal tell you she had multiple

23 sclerosis?

24 A. No, sir.

25 Q. You don't remember this conversation?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

330

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 A. No.

2 Q. Did you ever work on a Saturday with Ms. Leventhal?

3 A. I would have to check the records but I'm quite sure we

4 did.

5 Q. OK. And when you -- and you did tell Ms. Leventhal you

6 had high blood pressure, and do you recall what

7 Ms. Leventhal's response was?

8 A. I don't understand.

9 Q. Well, do you recall telling her you have high blood

10 pressure?

11 A. I told many of my employees that, yes.

12 Q. Do you recall specifically telling Ms. Leventhal that?

13 A. Not specifically but I probably told her.

14 Q. Well, Ms. Grant, you would say it's improper for a

15 provisional employee to take a lot of days off, isn't that

16 correct?

17 A. That's correct.

18 Q. Are you familiar with an employee named Sean Davis?

19 A. Yes.

20 Q. Wasn't it true that Mr. Davis, in 1995, took a very large

21 number of days off?

22 A. I would have to check the records.

23 Q. OK. I am going to show you what's been marked as

24 Plaintiff's Exhibit 15. That may help you.

25 (Handing)

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

331

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 Did you ever see this document before?

2 A. I believe so.

3 Q. Do you know who prepared this document?

4 A. Mrs. Leventhal prepared it.

5 Q. OK. Do you know if Ms. Leventhal distributed a copy to

6 you?

7 A. She could have. I don't remember.

8 Q. OK. In the usual course of business, does a first-line

9 supervisor of an employee prepare such memorandums as this?

10 A. Yes.

11 Q. And in the normal course of -- and Ms. Leventhal prepared

12 this memo in the normal course of her business, isn't that

13 correct?

14 A. Yes.

15 MR. BRESSLER: Your Honor, I would like to move this

16 into evidence.

17 MR. FISHER: No objection.

18 THE COURT: Exhibit 15 is received.

19 (Plaintiff's Exhibit 15 received in evidence)

20 BY MR. BRESSLER:

21 Q. At the time that this memorandum was prepared, did

22 Ms. Leventhal come to you -- and this is in December 1995 --

23 and complain that Mr. Davis is taking too many absences?

24 A. Yes, he was terminated.

25 Q. Do you know when he was terminated?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

332

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 A. I don't remember the actual date, no.

2 Q. Isn't it correct that you told her to drop it?

3 A. No, I don't remember that.

4 Q. Didn't you tell her to leave it alone?

5 A. No.

6 Q. Do you know what happened to Mr. Davis?

7 A. He was arrested.

Note:  As were numerous others on Brenda Grant's watch, but the judge does not allow anything that will show Brenda Grant up as someone with poor supervisory judgment and someone who plays discriminatory favorites based on who and what they are.   Caryl Leventhal (plaintiff) would frequently tell her husband that to turn a blind on towards what was going on, you had to be an idiot, apathetic or complicit, because it was so open.  But to the US Attorney and the USDOJ, the most important thing is to keep this out of testimony.  It cuts to the heart of the extreme hostility displayed towards Caryl Leventhal by fellow employees and her staff.  But Judge Scheindlin joins the US Attorney in shielding the USDOJ and refuses to allow discussion of this crucial point.

8 Q. OK. And what was he arrested for?

9 A. I think something with --

10 MR. FISHER: Objection, relevance.

11 THE COURT: Sustained.

Note: In fact, this is very relevant.  It goes to the heart of Brenda Grant's credibility, the hostility shown Ms. Leventhal and the hostile environment in which Caryl Leventhal was forced to work.  But all this must be masked by keeping it out of trial testimony and running interference for over four years of US Department of Justice cover-up and obstructionism.  Prior to Ms. Leventhal's trial against the USDOJ, This writer never realized the protective relationship that exists between federal judges, the US Attorney's office and the US Department of Justice.

12 BY MR. BRESSLER:

13 Q. Now, Ms. Grant, you testified that -- well, one other

14 thing: Ms. Grant, at what point did you become

15 Ms. Leventhal's second-line supervisor?

16 A. Sometime in '96.

17 Q. OK. And isn't it correct that it was only until January

18 of 1996 that you prepared memos regarding, or notes yourself

19 regarding Ms. Leventhal?

20 A. Yes.

21 Q. And didn't you start preparing those letters after you

22 became her -- after you were her first-line supervisor and

23 when you were her second-line supervisor, isn't that correct?

24 A. Yes.

25 Q. And isn't it the primary responsibility of a first-line

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

333

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 supervisor to keep tabs on their immediate subordinates, not a

2 second-line supervisor?

3 A. No.

4 Q. That's not correct?

5 A. That's not correct.

6 Q. Doesn't that fall within the chain of command?

7 A. Somewhat. Her first-line supervisor was located on the

8 eighth floor. I was on the same floor as Mrs. Leventhal as a

9 second-line supervisor.

10 Q. OK. So you are saying -- is that a written policy that

11 second-line supervisors on the same floor as an employee have

12 supervisory capacity over them; is that some unwritten law or

13 written law somewhere?

14 A. I have an input as far as her performance work plan, yes;

15 that is the second-line supervisor.

16 Q. But, again, it was only until after you were not -- until

17 after you were -- sorry.

18 It was only when you were no longer her immediate

19 supervisor that you began taking notes about Ms. Leventhal,

20 isn't that correct?

21 A. Yes, I had to sign the work.

22 Q. But you found nothing worthy of writing notes while you

23 were her immediate supervisor, isn't that correct?

24 A. Yes, I tried to give her a chance.

25 Q. Well, are you saying writing notes is denying her a

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

334

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 chance?

2 A. No. What I'm saying is that for the first three months we

3 try to give an employee a chance in order to learn the

4 position of her duties. So, therefore, you would allow

5 certain things to happen. After about three months, then

6 someone should have some idea as to what their duties should

7 be.

8 Q. Well, wasn't it the duty of Ms. Grant's -- sorry,

9 Ms. Leventhal's first-line supervisor to prepare these notes?

10 A. Yes, she gave me input, as well.

11 Q. Now, yesterday you testified about a memorandum that was

12 dated I believe June 10, 1996.

13 A. Yes.

14 (Handing)

15 Q. Ms. Grant, as far as you know, Mrs. Leventhal never

16 received this memo, isn't that correct?

17 A. That's correct.

18 Q. OK. And this memo is designed to advise her she was

19 taking too much sick time, isn't that right?

20 A. That's correct, just to remind her that her leave balances

21 were low.

22 Q. Is there any particular reason that you prepared this memo

23 on the very day Ms. Leventhal made three calls to INS that she

24 was sick?

25 MR. FISHER: Objection. There is no foundation for

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

335

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 the question.

2 THE COURT: Let me hear it again.

3 MR. BRESSLER: I said, is there any reason you

4 prepared the memo on the date that Ms. Leventhal made three

5 calls that she was sick.

6 THE COURT: You are going to need to break that up

7 and see if there is a foundation.

8 MR. BRESSLER: OK.

9 BY MR. BRESSLER:

10 Q. Is it your testimony, Ms. Grant, that Ms. Leventhal never

11 called in sick in June of 1996?

12 A. I don't recall whether she ever called in sick. I do

13 recall a conversation with her husband, but the date I don't

14 remember.

15 Q. Do you know if Ms. Leventhal herself ever called in sick

16 in June of 1996?

17 A. No.

18 Q. No, you mean you don't remember it?

19 A. That's correct, I don't remember it.

20 Q. So she may have called in sick?

21 A. She may have called in sick.

22 Q. OK. Well, wasn't it your testimony that she did not call

23 in sick?

24 MR. FISHER: Objection. It mischaracterizes the

25 testimony.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

336

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 Q. Wasn't that your testimony on direct examination?

2 A. She could have. I really don't remember. This is four

3 years ago.

4 Q. OK. Now, Ms. Grant, prior to your current position, you

5 were once the supervisory applications clerk in Section 245,

6 isn't that right?

7 A. That's correct.

8 Q. Have you ever made any mistakes while on that job?

9 A. What do you mean by "mistakes"?

10 Q. Have you ever made any errors in performing your job

11 duties?

12 A. No. In fact, I received outstanding awards throughout my

13 entire career.

14 Q. So it's your testimony that you are a perfect employee?

15 A. I'd say I am. I don't know what someone else would say.

16 Q. Do you ever make a mistake in writing a phone message?

17 A. Of course not.

18 Q. What?

19 A. No.

20 Q. Never?

21 A. No.

22 Q. Did you ever fail to put a zip code in an address?

23 A. I could have. I don't recall. You would have to show me.

24 I say no.

25 Q. OK. Did you ever misspell a word?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

337

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 A. No, I am a very good speller.

2 Q. OK. Did you ever send an inter-office memo to the wrong

3 person?

4 A. Can you repeat the question, please?

5 Q. Did you ever send an inter-office memo to the wrong

6 person?

7 A. Not that I can recall, no.

8 Q. Now, all of these mistakes, are they usually grounds for

9 termination?

10 MR. FISHER: Objection. It is a confusing question.

11 I'm not sure what --

12 THE COURT: It is.

13 If any one of these things happened just once to

14 somebody, would that be a ground for termination?

15 THE WITNESS: No, of course not.

16 THE COURT: But in combination, if they happened

17 repeatedly to the same person, would that be a ground for

18 termination?

19 THE WITNESS: Yes, your Honor.

20 THE COURT: It is all a matter of degree?

21 THE WITNESS: Yes.

22 THE COURT: And frequency?

23 THE WITNESS: Yes.

24 BY MR. BRESSLER:

25 Q. OK. Ms. Grant, at the time that Ms. Leventhal was the

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

338

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 supervisory applications clerk, who was her immediate

2 subordinate?

3 A. What period of time are you talking about?

4 Q. In 1995, in 1996.

5 A. In 1995, I was her immediate supervisor when she came on

6 board.

7 Q. My question is: Who was her immediate subordinate? Who

8 was right below her?

9 A. Oh, Dolores Filbert.

10 Q. Did Ms. Leventhal ever complain about problems with

11 Ms. Filbert?

12 A. Many times.

13 Q. Do you recall -- well, do you recall the nature of

14 Ms. Leventhal's complaint?

15 A. That Dolores wouldn't assist her.

16 Q. OK. That is fine.

17 A. That's all.

18 Q. And did you intervene on Ms. Leventhal's behalf?

19 A. Many times.

20 Q. Well, isn't it true that you took the side of Ms. Filbert

21 in disputes with Ms. Leventhal?

22 A. No.

23 Q. OK. Is it your testimony that you always took the side of

24 Ms. Leventhal when she had a dispute with a subordinate?

25 A. No.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

339

09rdlev1 vb

Grant - cross

1 Q. OK. Can you name any time where you took -- where you

2 didn't take Ms. Leventhal's side in a dispute with a

3 subordinate?

4 A. When Ms. Leventhal failed to assign the work to her staff,

5 and I had to ask Ms. Filbert to assist me in assigning the

6 work to her staff.

7 (Continued on next page)

8

9

10

11

12

13

14

15

16

17

18

19

20

21

22

23

24

25

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

340

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. Now, do you believe Ms. Leventhal took an excessive number

2 of absences?

3 A. Yes, for a probationary employee, yes.

4 Q. What is the usual amount of absences for a probationary

5 employee?

6 A. There is no set amount. It's just the fact of your being

7 there in order to perform the duties of your job. She wasn't

8 there.

9 Q. Are you including 400 AWOL hours in that characterization?

10 MR. FISHER: Objection as misstating the number of

11 AWOL hours.

Note:  Actually, Caryl's attorney is not misstating the number of AWOL hours.  It was 360 when Ms. Grant filed her request for Ms. Leventhal's termination but went on until her termination on August 8, 1996.

12 Q. Are you including a number of AWOL hours in that

13 calculation?

14 A. Yes.

15 Q. Okay. Now, do you recall receiving a doctor's note from

16 Ms. Leventhal in June of 1996, correct?

17 A. Somewhere there, yes.

18 Q. Isn't it correct if an employee provides a doctor's note

19 that they were sick on a day that they should not be marked

20 AWOL?

21 A. No.

22 Q. That's not the procedure?

23 A. No, you have to request your sick leave or you have to

24 request advanced sick leave in writing and submit your

25 doctor's note.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

341

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. So if an employee feels very sick on a morning, how do

2 they request sick leave?

3 A. The employee themselves will call into the immediate

4 supervisor and request sick leave.

5 Q. And isn't it the case that Ms. Leventhal did call in sick?

6 MR. FISHER: Objection, asked and answered.

7 THE COURT: Yes, we have had that question before.

8 Twice, because you asked her what she said yesterday.

9 Q. I'm a little confused. Your testimony is you don't

10 remember if she called in sick and now you're saying she did

11 not call in sick.

12 A. What I'm saying is I spoke to her husband, I don't recall

13 speaking to her. That's what I'm saying.

14 Q. But she may have called in?

15 MR. FISHER: Objection, asked and answered.

16 THE COURT: Sustained.

17 Q. Now, Ms. Leventhal was absent from work between June 10,

18 1996 and August 8, 1996, isn't that correct?

19 A. I guess so, if that's what the record states.

20 Q. Did you make any attempt to contact her by phone?

21 A. No.

22 Q. Did you ask anyone else to call Mrs. Leventhal by phone?

23 A. No.

24 Q. Did you attempt to contact her by mail?

25 A. No.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

342

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. Did you ask anyone to contact her by mail?

2 A. No, not that I recall, no.

3 Q. Did you make any attempt whatsoever to find out her

4 condition?

5 A. No.

6 Q. Have you ever contacted another employee at home to find

7 out their condition?

8 A. No.

9 Q. Did you have any concern about the health of Ms. Leventhal

10 in this period?

11 A. I assumed she just wasn't showing up. It's her

12 responsibility to call in.

13 Q. And you assumed she was just showing up after you received

14 the doctor's note?

15 A. I don't understand your question.

Note:  You don't understand the question?  And you call Caryl Leventhal incompetent?

16 Q. You received a doctor's note from Ms. Leventhal's doctor,

17 that was your testimony.

18 A. Yes.

19 Q. So why would you assume she was just not showing up?

20 A. I don't know. I just assumed she wasn't showing up.

21 Q. And didn't her doctor's note mention she had multiple

22 sclerosis?

23 A. Yes, it did.

24 Q. And that did not concern you?

25 A. No, not with the amount of employees that I have, no.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

343

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. Now, did you receive any mail from Mr. Leventhal or

2 Mrs. Leventhal in June of 1996?

3 A. I don't remember. Could have.

4 Q. I'd like to show the witness what has been marked as

5 Plaintiff's Exhibits 20-24?

6 THE COURT: Which ones?

7 MR. BRESSLER: 20-23.

8 THE COURT: The letters?

9 MR. BRESSLER: Yes.

10 THE COURT: Are they missing?

11 MR. BRESSLER: Yes.

12 THE COURT: They were up there yesterday.

13 MR. BRESSLER: I know.

14 THE COURT: Do you want my copies?

15 MR. BRESSLER: Yes.

16 THE COURT: 20-23. Do you want me to show it to the

17 witness?

18 MR. BRESSLER: Yes, please, your Honor.

19 (Handed to the witness)

20 Q. Take number 20.

21 A. I can't read the very top because there's a stamp on it.

22 Q. Look at the next page.

23 A. Yes.

24 Q. You recall receiving this letter?

25 A. Yes.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

344

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. And it was sent certified mail, return receipt requested,

2 was it not?

3 A. Yes.

4 Q. And that mentioned that Ms. Leventhal was suffering from

5 multiple sclerosis, didn't it?

6 A. Yes. It's from her husband, yes.

7 Q. And also I'd like to now have you look at Exhibit 21. Do

8 you recall receiving that?

9 A. It's written to Mr. Brouillet. I could have gotten a

10 copy, I don't recall.

11 Q. If you look down on the cc.

12 A. Yes.

13 Q. Is your name listed?

14 A. My name is there.

15 Q. Do you remember receiving this letter?

16 A. Could have.

17 Q. Okay. Now, didn't these letters notify you that

18 Ms. Leventhal was suffering from multiple sclerosis?

19 A. Yes. It's from her. The second letter is from her. But

20 there's no doctor's note attached.

21 Q. Okay. Did one of the letters include a doctor's note?

22 A. I don't recall. This is 1996 we're talking about.

23 Q. But it is your testimony that you did receive a doctor's

24 note in this period.

25 A. That's correct.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

345

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. And isn't it the case that because Ms. Leventhal called in

2 sick, wrote letters, sent a doctor's note, she should not have

3 been marked AWOL?

4 A. She would still have to call in to a supervisor to get it

5 authorized. Just because she sent a letter in doesn't mean

6 that it's authorized.

7 Q. Is there any reason why you didn't authorize her sick

8 leave?

9 A. I guess she didn't call in.

10 Q. Okay. So if there's phone records demonstrating

11 Ms. Leventhal called in sick, are those records incorrect?

12 MR. FISHER: Objection, hypothetical.

13 THE COURT: I'll allow it. If there are any such

14 records.

15 A. It depends on who she spoke to. Did she speak to me, did

16 she speak to Mrs. Stewart, did she speak to another

17 supervisor, I don't know.

18 Q. If she did speak to Mrs. Stewart, would that be a valid

19 way of asking for sick leave, requesting sick leave?

20 A. Yes, it would be.

21 Q. All right. Did you make any effort to find out when

22 Ms. Leventhal may be returning to work?

23 A. I told you no.

24 Q. Okay. I'd like to show you what's been previously marked

25 as Plaintiff's Exhibit 7, I'm sorry, Exhibit 9.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

346

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 (Handed to the witness)

2 MR. BRESSLER: And I believe this is in evidence,

3 your Honor.

4 Q. Are you familiar with Plaintiff's Exhibit 9, what that is?

5 A. Yes, I am.

6 Q. And what is that?

7 A. It's a position description.

8 Q. And is it a position description for a supervisory

9 application clerk?

10 A. Yes, it is.

11 Q. Does that accurately reflect the job duties and

12 responsibilities of a supervisory applications clerk in the

13 years 1995 and 1996?

14 A. Somewhat.

15 Q. Well, isn't that the official designation of the duties

16 for that position?

17 A. Yes, it is.

18 Q. Anywhere within that document does that include carrying

19 heavy boxes or climbing high shelves?

20 A. It's always listed as "other duties as assigned."

21 Q. Is it normal for managerial employees to be lifting heavy

22 boxes and climbing large shelves?

23 A. I did it but if you have your staff, you can have someone

24 else do it.

25 Q. Didn't Ms. Leventhal constantly tell you she's suffering

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

347

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 and feeling pain in completing those duties?

2 A. No, sir.

3 Q. Did she ever tell you she's having trouble carrying boxes?

4 A. Yes, she did.

5 MR. FISHER: Objection, asked and answered.

6 THE COURT: I'll allow it. She did.

7 Q. How often did she tell you that?

8 A. I can't tell you how often she said it, but I can tell you

9 that she did say it and I told her that she has a staff.

10 Q. Did she not ask you -- well, didn't she ask -- did she not

11 ask her staff to help her?

12 A. I don't understand your question. Did she ask her staff

13 to help her?

14 Q. To your knowledge, did Ms. Leventhal ask her staff to help

15 her carry boxes?

16 A. I don't know whether she did or she didn't. She never

17 complained to me that anyone refused to do it.

18 Q. Well, isn't it the case that some of her staff came to you

19 and complained that Ms. Leventhal was asking them to carry

20 boxes?

21 A. No, I don't recall that.

22 Q. Okay. And isn't it true that you told Ms. Leventhal that

23 that's your job, not your staff's job?

24 A. No, that's not correct.

25 Q. And also, didn't Ms. Leventhal tell you that the reason

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

348

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 she's having trouble carrying these boxes and climbing these

2 shelves is because she suffers from multiple sclerosis?

3 A. No, that's not correct.

4 Q. Well, did she tell you the reason she's having trouble

5 doing those things?

6 A. No, she never did.

7 Q. Can you tell me who Celeste Praither is?

8 A. She was a district adjudication officer that was

9 terminated.

10 Q. Okay. And was she under your command?

11 A. Yes, she was.

12 Q. Do you know if she was arrested?

13 MR. FISHER: Objection, relevance.

14 THE COURT: Sustained.

15 Q. Well, Ms. Grant, in the time you were working there,

16 weren't there a number of employees, a great number of

17 employees who were arrested?

18 MR. FISHER: Objection, relevance.

19 THE COURT: Sustained.

20 Q. Okay, Ms. Grant, are you familiar with a program called

21 Citizenship USA?

22 MR. FISHER: Objection, relevance.

23 THE COURT: Sustained.

24 Q. Ms. Grant, do you know the religion of Ms. Filbert?

25 A. Yes, I do.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

349

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. What is that?

2 A. Catholic.

3 Q. Okay. And so as a Catholic, she doesn't normally

4 celebrate Yom Kippur, isn't that correct?

5 A. I wouldn't know that.

6 Q. Okay. Isn't it correct that it's the policy of the

7 Immigration and Naturalization Service to allow employees to

8 take off for their religious holidays?

9 A. Yes, it is, if they prepare a memorandum.

10 Q. And didn't Ms. Leventhal prepare a memorandum that she

11 would like to take off for Yom Kippur?

12 A. No, she didn't.

13 Q. Wasn't that the memorandum you were just shown as

14 Plaintiff's Exhibit 16?

15 A. No. The memorandum that you're talking about is a leave

16 request memorandum from her employees, all right, that is

17 granting annual leave for a leave year. When you're

18 requesting time off for your religious holiday, you have to

19 put it in an official memorandum to your supervisor and this

20 is not the same.

21 Q. Well, this memorandum was -- well, what's been marked, the

22 second page of Plaintiff's Exhibit 16, was this not given to

23 you?

24 A. Yes, it was. But it's not correct.

25 Q. And wasn't it sent by Ms. Leventhal?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

350

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 A. Yes, but it was incorrect.

2 Q. Why was it incorrect?

3 A. Because it's a leave memorandum in reference to her

4 employees for the leave year. If you're requesting time off

5 for religious holiday, you must put it in writing to your

6 first line supervisor requesting the time off.

7 Q. Okay. But doesn't this memo convey the message that

8 Ms. Leventhal wanted to take off on September 23rd in the year

9 1996?

10 A. Yes, it states that she's authorizing her own leave, yes.

11 Q. Well, I mean, if you approve the leave upon receiving it,

12 wouldn't that be authorized?

13 A. No.

14 Q. You don't have the power to grant Ms. Leventhal leave?

15 A. Of course I do if she puts it in the correct format.

16 Q. So the main problem you have with this memo is it's in the

17 wrong format?

18 A. That's correct. She's granting her own leave, something

19 that you can't do.

20 Q. Well, couldn't you deem this a request for a leave?

21 A. No.

22 Q. Because it wasn't in the right format.

23 A. That's correct.

24 Q. So format is your main concern.

25 A. That's correct.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

351

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. Isn't it the case that getting the job done no matter what

2 the quality of the job is your main concern?

3 A. Yes, it is.

4 Q. So quality doesn't matter to you?

5 A. Quality and quantity matters to me.

6 Q. Isn't it true that Ms. Leventhal would constantly tell

7 you, hand you work and say this work is not complete, it's not

8 done properly?

9 A. You have to give me an example of what you're talking

10 about.

11 Q. Okay. Didn't Ms. Leventhal tell you on a number of

12 occasions that the files were not being processed correctly?

13 A. If she did, that was her job to get it done.

14 Q. Was it your main concern that the job get done, not that

15 it get done correctly?

16 A. That's not true.

17 Q. Do you recall hearing any information that INS has been

18 criticized for not doing their job correctly and just trying

19 to get their job done?

20 MR. FISHER: Objection.

21 THE COURT: Sustained.

22 Q. Ms. Grant, do you know of religion of Mr. Wasserman?

23 A. Yes, I do.

24 Q. And what is that religion?

25 A. He's Jewish.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

352

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. Now, wouldn't it be correct to allow two Jews, the two

2 Jews in Section 245, to take off for their highest holiday?

3 A. Yes, if you put your request in writing.

4 Q. Okay. So again, the main issue is -- well, isn't this a

5 writing?

6 A. It's a writing, but it's incorrect.

7 Q. Okay. So what you're saying is that if it was

8 correctly -- the fact that it's not in writing is more

9 important than the fact that this was a very important holiday

10 to Ms. Leventhal?

11 A. I never knew it was the holiday for Mrs. Leventhal, she

12 never brought that to my attention.

13 Q. Didn't she in fact come to you at least once a week from

14 February 1996 until June 1996 that she wanted to take off for

15 Yom Kippur?

16 A. She never stated that was the reason why she wanted off.

17 Q. Did she ever tell you -- well, did you have more than one

18 conversation with her about her taking that holiday off?

19 A. No. Because if so, I would have told her to put it in the

20 correct format.

21 Q. And you've never granted anyone leave when they didn't

22 put -- that it wasn't in the correct format?

23 MR. FISHER: Objection.

24 THE COURT: Overruled, I'll allow that. Have you

25 granted leave when someone made a request that was not in the

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

353

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 right format.

2 THE WITNESS: No, I would instruct them how to do it.

3 Q. Did you ever instruct Ms. Leventhal how to do it?

4 A. No, because she never told me that she wanted off because

5 of religious holiday.

6 Q. Ms. Grant, did you ever give Ms. Leventhal a warning

7 letter that she would be subject to termination?

8 A. No.

9 Q. Isn't it the normal procedure to give an employee a

10 warning letter before you terminate her?

11 A. Not a probationary employee, no, it's not.

12 Q. Have you ever given a probationary employee a warning

13 letter before you terminated them?

14 A. No, I have not.

15 Q. Do you believe -- you did testify that you did yell at

16 Ms. Leventhal on occasion, is that correct?

17 A. Yes, I have.

18 Q. How often would you say you yelled at Ms. Leventhal?

19 A. I guess every time she made a serious error, mistake or

20 she failed to instruct her employees properly.

21 Q. And how often was that?

22 A. I can't recall. You're talking about four years ago.

23 Q. So would you say you yelled at Ms. Leventhal more than you

24 yelled at any other employee?

25 A. You mean in my history at INS? Because the answer to that

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

354

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 would be no.

2 Q. Say in the last five years.

3 A. No.

4 Q. Well, in 1995 and 1996 isn't it true that you yelled at

5 Ms. Leventhal more than you yelled at any other employee?

6 A. Could be more or less, I'm not really sure.

7 Q. Now, you were responsible, correct me if I'm wrong, you

8 were responsible for the decision to terminate Ms. Leventhal.

9 A. No, I wasn't. I gave my recommendation for termination.

10 Q. Okay. But you -- isn't it correct that normally the upper

11 management would consent to such a recommendation?

12 A. They would make the final determination, that's correct.

13 Q. Did you ever have a recommendation of termination that was

14 denied by the upper management?

15 A. No.

16 Q. So normally they rely on the lower management to make the

17 termination decisions?

18 A. The recommendation, yes.

19 Q. So when you made this recommendation, you pretty much knew

20 Ms. Leventhal was going to be terminated.

21 A. No, I did not.

22 Q. Incidentally, Ms. Grant, how long have you worked for INS?

23 A. 29 years.

24 Q. In your 29 years, upper management has never vetoed a

25 recommendation to terminate an employee that you prepared,

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

355

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 isn't that correct?

2 A. That's correct.

3 Q. And how many such termination memos, recommendations have

4 you prepared in your career?

5 A. I've done two.

6 Q. Well, isn't it correct that upper management will respect

7 the chain of command and if a person who has immediate contact

8 with an employee recommends termination, they would usually

9 grant the termination?

10 MR. FISHER: Objection.

11 THE COURT: Is that your understanding?

12 A. I don't understand what he said.

13 Q. Isn't it correct --

14 MR. BRESSLER: Can you read back the question.

15 (Record read)

16 A. I can't speak for upper management.

17 Q. Ms. Grant, didn't you realistically believe that once you

18 wrote that recommendation for termination, that Ms. Leventhal

19 would be terminated?

20 A. I believed it because I had evidence to substantiate my

21 recommendation.

22 Q. Did you ever say you would give a reference to

23 Ms. Leventhal?

24 A. She never asked for one.

25 Q. Did you ever tell her you would give her a good reference?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

356

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 A. I don't recall saying that.

2 Q. Ms. Grant, isn't it correct that you did not want

3 Ms. Leventhal in Section 245?

4 A. That's not correct.

5 Q. And you never asked her to transfer out?

6 A. Of course not.

7 Q. You never asked her, you never said, "if you leave now,

8 you could get a good recommendation?"

9 A. Never.

10 Q. Ms. Grant, do you think it's wrong for a person born

11 Christian to practice another religion?

12 A. I have no feelings about that. To each his own.

13 Q. Were you involved in decorating the office during

14 Christmas season at Section 245?

15 A. I personally, no. But I had employees that would decorate

16 the office during the holiday season.

17 Q. Did you not refuse Ms. Leventhal's opportunity to put up a

18 small Chanukkah menorah on her desk?

19 A. Of course not.

20 Q. Ms. Grant, did you ever yell at Ms. Leventhal in front of

21 staff, her staff?

22 A. Could have.

23 Q. Could you have done it on more than one occasion?

24 A. Could have.

25 Q. Could you have done it on numerous occasions?

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

357

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 A. Could have.

2 Q. And don't you believe that undermines the authority of

3 managers by doing that?

4 A. The employees knew themselves that she was incompetent.

5 Q. Did you question the employees about whether or not she

6 was incompetent?

7 A. No, but they came to me to tell me.

8 Q. Okay. And then did you not embarrass Ms. Leventhal in

9 front of her employees?

10 A. Could have.

11 Q. Did you think about -- before you embarrassed

12 Ms. Leventhal, did you think this could embarrass

13 Ms. Leventhal?

14 A. No.

15 Q. Okay. Well, don't you think it's important not to

16 undermine the authority of a supervisor?

17 A. No, when they're not doing their job, no.

18 Q. So if they're not doing their job, you should do whatever

19 you can to undermine their authority.

20 A. No, I guess I shouldn't. But I did.

21 Q. If Ms. MacPherson did the same to you, how would that make

22 you feel?

23 A. It's been done, believe me.

24 Q. Do you think that's a proper management practice?

25 A. It may not be, but it gets the job done.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

358

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. Well, I mean, wouldn't it -- how does that get -- wouldn't

2 a subordinate then not respect the authority of the superior

3 by you doing that?

4 MR. FISHER: Objection, asked and answered.

5 THE COURT: Sustained.

6 Q. Well, isn't it your testimony that the job didn't get

7 done, even though you did embarrass and humiliate

8 Ms. Leventhal?

9 A. That's correct.

10 Q. Okay. And you did embarrass and humiliate Ms. Leventhal?

11 A. If she took it that way, I guess so.

12 Q. If it was done to you, would you have taken it that way?

13 A. It's been done several times.

14 Q. And did you take it that way?

15 A. I took it that way but I got the job done.

16 Q. Did you take into consideration when you were embarrassing

17 and humiliating her that she had multiple sclerosis?

18 A. How would I know that?

19 Q. If you did know she had multiple sclerosis, would you have

20 chosen a different approach?

21 MR. FISHER: Objection.

22 THE COURT: Sustained.

23 Q. Did you ever embarrass and humiliate another manager under

24 your command?

25 A. Several.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

359

09rilev2 ag

Grant - cross

1 Q. So it wasn't just because Ms. Leventhal was Jewish that

2 you embarrassed and humiliated her?

3 A. No.

4 Q. So you're an equal opportunity embarrasser and humiliator?

5 A. If you want to call me that.

6 MR. BRESSLER: Just one second.

7 (Pause)

8 Q. Ms. Grant, do you have any friends that are Jewish?

9 MR. FISHER: Objection.

10 THE COURT: Sustained.

11 Q. Have you ever had any problems working with other Jewish

12 employees?

13 A. Never.

14 Q. Have you ever laughed at Mel Wasserman?

15 A. No.

16 Q. Well, isn't it true that -- can you name any other

17 employee that you embarrassed and humiliated?

18 A. Do you have that much time? I mean even today in Newark,

19 I mean I could go on and on and on with a list of names, but

20 you wouldn't know who they are.

21 Q. I mean, wouldn't you say this would create a hostile

22 environment for an employee?

23 MR. FISHER: Objection.

24 THE COURT: Sustained.

25 MR. BRESSLER: I have nothing further.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

360

09rilev2 ag

Grant - redirect

1 THE COURT: Thank you. Redirect, Mr. Fisher.

2 REDIRECT EXAMINATION

3 BY MR. FISHER:

4 Q. Mrs. Grant, if Mrs. Leventhal was so incompetent and such

5 an ineffective supervisor, how is it that the work got done in

6 Section 245 while she was there?

7 MR. BRESSLER: Objection. Leading the witness.

8 THE COURT: Let me hear the question again.

9 (Record read)

10 THE COURT: Objection sustained.

Note:  This is objectivity in the federal judiciary when dealing with a case against the US Department of Justice:  Kill key evidence about Brenda Grant's department being a den of subsequently arrested felons.  Sustain objections to facts proving that while Brenda Grant was conducting a bigoted vendetta against Caryl Leventhal, a large percentage of Ms. Grant's people are conducting on-site criminal activity right under her nose.  And sustain any objections by the US Attorney to keep the jury from seeing that Brenda Grant was someone of limited management and evaluative skills.  Truly, the US Department of Justice is a protected entity and the US Attorney's office is viewed as a "friend" of the court.  G-d save the Republic.

11 Q. Mrs. Grant, during Mrs. Leventhal's period of working at

12 INS, how is it that the work got done in Section 245?

13 A. I assigned the work to the clerical staff. Agatha Stewart

14 also assigned work to the clerical staff. And Delores

15 Filbert.

16 Q. And was that a departure from how the work ought to be

17 done when there's a supervisory applications clerk on staff?

18 A. Yes, it is.

19 Q. How is it such a departure?

20 A. It takes me away from doing my personal duties,

21 Mrs. Stewart, who was also assigned to the officers, and she

22 should be assisting her lead clerk, which is Ms. Filbert.

23 Q. Did you ever purposefully set out to embarrass

24 Mrs. Leventhal?

25 A. No, I did not.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

361

09rilev2 ag

Grant - redirect

1 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, may I have one moment?

2 (Pause)

3 Q. Mrs. Grant, did you ever purposefully set out to humiliate

4 Mrs. Leventhal?

5 A. No, I did not.

6 MR. FISHER: Nothing further.

7 RECROSS-EXAMINATION

8 BY MR. BRESSLER:

9 Q. Ms. Grant, did you provide any training to Ms. Leventhal?

10 A. Yes, I did.

11 Q. What was the nature of that training?

12 A. The processing of application, the distribution of the

13 work assignments to her staff.

14 Q. Do you know when you did this?

15 A. When she came on board.

16 Q. Did you ever have any staff meetings?

17 MR. FISHER: Objection. This is beyond the scope.

18 THE COURT: It is and I'll allow it anyway. Go

19 ahead.

20 Q. Did you ever have any staff meetings?

21 THE COURT: Of course she has staff meetings.

22 Q. Isn't it correct that you excluded Ms. Leventhal

23 repeatedly from those meetings?

24 A. During the time that she wasn't performing her duties and

25 I had to get the job done, the answer to that is yes.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

362

09rilev2 ag

Grant - recross

1 Q. Okay. So you had a meeting with Ms. Leventhal's

2 subordinates without Ms. Leventhal being there?

3 A. Yes, because she wasn't completing the job.

4 MR. BRESSLER: Okay.

5 MR. FISHER: Your Honor, I may have one or two more

6 questions, if I could just have a moment.

7 THE COURT: Yes.

8 (Pause)

9 REDIRECT EXAMINATION

10 BY MR. FISHER:

11 Q. Mrs. Grant, these meetings with Mrs. Filbert that you just

12 told us about, why is it that you met with Mrs. Filbert

13 without Mrs. Leventhal present?

14 A. Because Ms. Leventhal --

15 MR. BRESSLER: Your Honor, that's not what the

16 testimony was.

17 THE COURT: Say it again.

18 Let me hear the question again.

19 (Record read)

20 THE COURT: The question originally was that there

21 was certain staff meetings that you had without Ms. Leventhal

22 present and we want to know why she was kept out of the

23 meetings that you had at that time.

24 A. She failed to complete her job assignments, so therefore I

25 had to get the work done so I had Ms. Filbert get the work

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

363

09rilev2 ag

Grant - redirect

1 done.

2 THE COURT: Why did you not want her at the meeting?

3 THE WITNESS: Because she was incompetent at that

4 time and she could not perform the duties of her job.

5 THE COURT: So it would be counterproductive in the

6 meeting, is that what you're saying?

7 THE WITNESS: No, just to get the work assignments

8 out to the staff, I would have a meeting with Filbert in order

9 to have the work assigned right away.

10 THE COURT: It just wasn't necessary to have her at

11 that meeting.

12 THE WITNESS: No.

13 MR. FISHER: There's some confusion because there was

14 a reference to staff meetings.

15 THE COURT: I know. I think this is what we're

16 talking about.

17 THE WITNESS: Staff meetings. I never had a lot of

18 staff meetings with them because I was a section chief at that

19 time. But the meetings that I did have, like a sidebar

20 meeting, it was in reference to the work assignments.

21 MR. FISHER: Nothing further.

22 THE COURT: Anything further of this witness or are

23 we done?

24 MR. BRESSLER: One.

25 (Continued on next page)

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

364

09rilev2 ag

Grant - recross

1 RECROSS-EXAMINATION

2 BY MR. BRESSLER:

3 Q. Ms. Grant, you've used the term "incompetent" a lot in

4 your testimony, isn't that correct?

5 A. That's correct.

6 Q. And you testified that the reason you took notes on

7 Ms. Leventhal wasn't that she was a probationary employee but

8 because she was incompetent?

9 A. She was an incompetent probationary employee, that's

10 correct.

11 Q. You prepared, you testified you prepared a memo in

12 February.

13 A. Yes.

14 Q. Do you have a copy of that memo?

15 A. I don't have it with me.

16 Q. Did you ever produce it to anyone?

17 A. No, I did not.

18 Q. Was there any reason you gave leniency to Ms. Leventhal in

19 February?

20 A. I've always tried to be a very fair supervisor, so I

21 wanted to give her more time in order to learn a position to

22 correct whatever errors that were being made.

23 Q. Okay. And part of being fair includes humiliating and

24 embarrassing an employee, is that correct?

25 MR. FISHER: Objection.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

365

09rilev2 ag

Grant - recross

1 THE COURT: Sustained. It's argumentative.

2 MR. BRESSLER: Nothing further.

3 THE COURT: Mr. Fisher?

4 MR. FISHER: Nothing further, your Honor.

5 THE COURT: Thank you, Ms. Grant.

6 THE WITNESS: Thank you, your Honor.

7 THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, it's time for the

8 afternoon -- morning recess, I'm getting ahead of myself here,

9 so we will reconvene at a quarter to twelve on that clock.

SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.

212-805-0300

Caryl Leventhal never gets the opportunity of Rebuttal although this is the normal procedure in a trial.  Thanks to stress and distress from the not very veiled threats of the US Attorney Criminal Division some three days prior to trial (September 22, 2000), Ms. Leventhal -- a woman declared totally disabled -- is too debilitated through terror to take the stand any more.  She is denied a fair trial, although the jury has been kept from hearing any of this information.

Commentary and Editor's Notes written and Copyright © by:  LTC Michael G. Leventhal

Copyright 2000  Reproduction with written permission.  Contact: Michael @Justice-Denied.net